OBAMA IS THE 44^th PRESIDENT OF THE U.S.!!!!!!!!!!!!! :multidance: :D :multidance: :D :multidance: :D :multidance: omg :) :dance: :multidance: omg :flag: :multidance: :D :multidance: :D :multidance: :D :multidance: omg :) :dance: :multidance: omg :flag: :multidance: :D :multidance: :D :multidance: :D :multidance: omg :) :dance: :multidance: omg :flag:

Landslide Victory.

Obama - 338
McCain - 156

Not that I particularly care, though I should, congrats BA.

Actually, many of the states were a lot closer then what the electoral votes show.

I'm not particularly happy with an Obama presidency, especially with a democratic congress.

.....................................................................................................................

Im just gonna walk away. I was gonna post about this but its gonna be pointless...................................................................................................

its spreading

Finally an african american as president proves once and for all that every race is equal to those who didn't believe.

that i will agree on but its all i will agree on

Congrats to Obama, he really deserves it. A lot of people wanted him to be president. ;)
;D :)

Nice, my Uncle who lives in USA also voted on him. McCain seemed to me like a second Bush.

Yep, I agree. I find it funny how McCain changed his campaign mid race. I think it only showed how inconsistent he really is.

How can he claim originality when Obama was promising Change since the beginning? As soon a he chose Palin, it was "Original Mavericks" he only chose her because he wanted to try and get some of the support that Clinton had among female voters.

I like that Obama was consistent with his message throughout the race, and I liked where he stood on the important issues, and that was why I voted for him. All McCain was lobbying for was the support of the rich, and those who didn't mind Americans dying overseas, just as long as it wasn't theirs. Some might join the army because they want to fight for their country, but a LOT join because of the opportunities it promises. The rich don't have to worry about that as much because they have more of an opportunity and more money to persue them.

While Obama spoke directly to the little man, those who were most affected most by the economy, and addressed their concerns, McCain spoke to the wealthy, and that is what hurt him. He simply doesn't know how to relate to the Average Joe, and he doesn't know how to relate to minorities, as other Democratic hopefuls have in the past. That doesn't make him a bad guy, it makes him a bad candidate.

That said, I voted for Obama, and cried when he won. I haven't watched the World Series, Olympics or the Super Bowl as hard as I was watching last night's election. I was skeptikal at first, but I am happy that he won.

They took a poll, and the majority said that race was not a factor in this election.. I believe it was 84% that said that. 63% said that the economy was the most important issue. While others said that it was healthcare. There were also some who voted for him even though they knew that it meant that they'd have to pay higher taxes. For crying out loud, he flipped 7 Republican states, and took the states Bush had in 2004.

However, I would be lying if I said that I wasn't proud of the fact that we have made it from Slavery to the White House.. but I don't consider that to be a Black thing so much as it is an American thing. I simply voted for the person I felt the most confident about, (like I always do,) and if that person happens to be from a different party then so be it.

This just happens to be the second time I went Democrat. :)

And technogeek, please edit your post to remove those periods.. they are stretching the tables..

My dad works 7 days a week almost every week. My family earns over 250,000 a year. My sister is in the Air Force, my brother in the Army, and my other brother in the Navy. Both of my parents served in the Army.

McCain didn't fight for the people who didn't mind people dying over seas. That's outrageous to even think that. That's almost equal to calling the people who voted for him unpatriotic. McCain fought for the war because he has experience with it and because the terrorist over in the Middle East DO want to destroy us. If we pull from Iraq, after an especially successful serge, then it's encouraging the terrorist. In fact, if we leave before there is a stabilized government in Iraq there'll be more chaos that invokes overseas, as well as terrorist movement to bring the fight here. Doesn't seem likely? Look at 9/11 and the world today.

As for the economy. Obama's plan is ridiculous. I might as well not even work now. Obama will take care of me. I'll just go into that 38% of people who don't even pay taxes and will be getting welfare checks. Anyone under 250,000 a year gets a tax cut and 38% doesn't pay taxes under that. It is redistribution of wealth and it's stupid.. It is a socialist policy. I didn't call Obama a socialist, though he's the closest thing to one to ever reach the white house, but I said the policy is a socialist policy.

Palin was actually chosen to bring enthusiasm to the ticket and before the market crashed McCain was pulling ahead of Obama. I don't think she was McCain's down fall, especially since she had more experience then Obama. Palin actually did things as governor. What did Obama do as senator? Vote present and run for president.

Obama basically had this election given to him. McCain faired very well for the 8 years Bush handed the country. Obama had basically every media network in the country covering him and favoring him. Everything was against McCain so to say that Obama deserves to be president, or that he even earned it is preposterous. I could deal with Hilary Clinton or Biden, but Obama is not a person i will ever support, even as president of the United States.

wow......a man with the balls to post an argument......your my hero clockhass.

although i think we're all gonna have to bite the bullet on this one.

as i have said many times before.

"there comes a time when we must all play the pipes and eat crap"

as we will be doing after inaugeration. Im not against obama because he's black God no... I'm againt him because his religion is pretty screwed up. personally.....i think he's a liar.

He says he's a christian but my theory goes like this. No christian in the right mind is pro-choice. So yea there's gonna be change.....and change of the bad kind.

change 1. African american as president.......Ok no problem with this one. I have no problem with an african american as president. again its what he's gonna do that urks me.

change 2. changes to the national anthem....WHAT?! what reason is there to do that...

change 3. higher taxes.....ugh i just turned 18 come to find out soon im gonna have to pay high taxes.

change 4. democratic president......If it wasn't for the fact that i don't think obama's gonna do anything good in his term.....i would pu up with this.

now im really worried about change 2. yea yea ur probably thinking. "its a song...so what?" "SO WHAT!?" i would reply.....

It will be a cold day in hell....A F****** COLD DAY IN HELL....when some man....let alone the president....tries to change what this nation is based on.. Need I remind you this nation is built on "In God we trust" and "One nation under God" eventually everyone is going to forget that....and that's what sickens me about the human race....Caucasian, African American, Indian..etc.

AND I REFUSE TO SIT ON MY ASS AND LET THAT HAPPEN

sleep tonight with that on your mind.

Bullet time out!

pwned

Whether you agree with his policies or not, it doesn't change the fact that we have 4 years to see what kind of leader he'll turn out to be.The wealth distribution may be unfair, but I think that that might be a temporary solution to help rebuild the economy. I don't think that if it were permanent, that the Republican states would have gone for it. You don't think that Obama is the man for the job, well, unfortunately for you, the majority of the country says otherwise. Same thing with Bush.. many people didn't believe that he was the man for the job either, but there was still a majority of those who did.. in BOTH elections.

To say that this election was handed to him is ridiculous, because if that were the case then there would have been no point to having an election. He was given the same chance as any other candidate. You say that his religion is messed up, well, I have to agree with you there. There are far too many Christians out here trying to pass legistation, and restrict the rights of people because of the what is in the bible.. such as Gay Rights (be it adoption or marriage) and Abortion.

If you want to be technical, this country wasn't built. It was stolen, and those that lived here before, were forced off of their land, became victims of genocide, (many of them for their refusal to convert to Christianity..) with many of them dying as a result of the diseases that the Europeans brought with them when they came here.

I'm not even going to touch Christianity, as I have stated what I thought of it.

I admit that my statement about the war was unfair, and for that, I do apologize, however, as the last 8 years have shown, war doesn't solve everything. At some point, you'll have to stop and wonder if there really is another way. It looks like that when it comes to Iraq, there is no right answer.

I disagree with the statement about a Christian being Pro-Choice, on account of Free Will, which is supposed to be the right that God gave to ALL people. Otherwise, if he didn't want people to have a choice then he would have just forced him to do as he wants them.

Just because someone is pro-choice, doesn't mean that they are pro-abortion. Just because someone is pro-choice, doesn't mean that they are going to go out and have an abortion. It just means that they respect a woman's right to choose which option is best for her. I am pro-choice, and I have been pregnant, and I couldn't bring myself to do it.

I'm happy that the person I supported has won the election, he has a hell of a job ahead of him, and I am eager to see what kind of leader he will turn out to be. I think that it can only get better from here. As far as I am concerned, this country is based on freedom, and freedom of choice. I don't think that Obama is trying to change that.

That's all I have to say on this.

Techno, your argument is full of inconsistencies...

For Obama being a liar? maybe so, but don't ever think for a minute that Mccain was going to tell the truth for everything either. And in this case, what Obama believes in for himself is none of our business as long as he doesn't do like Bush and impose that religious will on everyone.

As for the higher taxes, do you realise that no matter which person won, the taxes were rising either way for some... It just so happens that Obama won. Now as for him being a socialist... (like you said Clockhass) You do know that socialist theory isn't all bad. A universal health care system does indeed work. (Which, I might add, I live in a country which has a universal health care system.) And the taxes you pay are not that much higher than you might think.

As well as redistributed wealth does help some... consider for a moment your life gets royally fucked, you don't get a good job right away, you get injured or something, without money there is nothing you can do and that may affect your family well into your kid's life times. With redistributed wealth it gives people a chance to change and get back on their feet. Which kind of leads me to my next point...

As it's going, the middle class is suffering worse and worse, the poor get poorer and the rich get richer. The poor pay for nothing because they can't and the rich pay for virtually nothing (well pay for less at any rate) because they know the tricks and secrets to saving money. So that leaves the middle class to pay for everything and drives them further down into poverty. Now what happens if too many become impoverished? Easy, economy collapses and it becomes a Marxist type revolution. Think civil war, except the rich are vastly out numbered. And if that happens the rich will not win.

As far as the national anthem, might be time for a change... The times have changed and it might be interesting to see what kind of song could be used to inspire the patriotism of the next generations. I mean let's face it, the old US anthem has had it's fair share of liars and poor representatives, it might be time for a change... Something new which could reunite a country.

But you know, just because the anthem may change doesn't mean what the country stands for has changed, it's not like you've heard what the new anthem is yet, right? so for all you know it could be better than the old one.

And my problem with the anthem is just that... Reliance on God... What happened to seperation of church and State? That kind of bought it with Bush in power and I think Obama realises this. It's time to set things right. If you don't like it... Tough shit. You're a big boy now, you can just learn to live with it. So in the future, try not to throw tantrums bout it, it won't solve anything, m'kay?

And speaking of Sarah Palin... Was she not the one who wasted Tax payers money to buy some expensive clothes or something stupid like that? Do you really want someone who would spend money on frivolous things like that? Atleast with Obama he's proposing a change which will benefit all with the universal health care.

Changes to the national anthem? When did this happen? I never heard anything of this nature until today. Frankly, I'm against it simply because the Star-Bangled Banner is an inspiring song to me. It echoes the battles we, as a country, had to face in order to prove that we are a powerful and free nation, despite America only being around for 200 some odd years. As far as the country being founded on religious beliefs, that may be true but I remind you that America was originally a colony of England used solely for the purpose of gaining wealth for the crown. I must also remind you that the first couple of colonies failed due to the fact that the so-called Christians just wanted to dig for gold. Religious beliefs may have a huge part in our lives but America is NOT the Jesus Show. If that were the case, why would people come from all over to world to America in order escape from religious oppression?

In his inaugural address, Abraham Lincoln said "The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battle-field, and patriot grave, to every living heart and hearthstone, all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature." With that being said, people have accused Obama of being Un-American due to the fact that he goes against his religion. They say he's Un-American because he doesn't wear a flag pin in his lapel. Because of these reasons, they don't consider him a true Patriot. Since when does being a Patriot mean that it is mandatory to wear a pin? Being Patriot is about standing up to fight for the values that this country was based on so that our children can see a better future. The Republicans can BAAAAWWWWW all they want but they can't change that fact that Obama, "Socialist" ideas and all, is now running the United States. be a decent American and simply give the man a chance. Live by the better angels of our nature and look to change the future to make it better than it was the first 200 or so years.

If I may say something, seeing at how the tax raising thing has been brought to my attention...
In order for us to get where we were when Bill Clinton was in office(meaning gas under $2), we need to raise taxes. Besides, with a raise in taxes comes a raise in paychecks.

I know I said that my second response was my last one, but this really is.

Well said both of you, and I agree with you both.

I think that the fact that he doesn't those things make him more of a Patriot, and more of an American, than someone who does. He is exercising his freedom to make those choices and that is what this country is about and that is what makes him an American.

Good point.. and it is one that is often overlooked by many.

Ok, now I'm done.. :p

O rly? :p

...I was going to post a VERY tl;dr comment, but i am deciding to just say this.

First off, this is a forum where people discuss all things, good AND bad. If you have something to say, SAY IT. You're not going to get banned for posting an opinion, so if you want to make obama hate threads, go ahead.

Not everyone makes over 250 grand a year. There are lots of minorities fuck that, they are the majority, who work just as hard and don't even scrape in that much. Your family makes over 250, so they would have to pay 20% now more taxes. That's 40+ grand. But for what you make, is that really a big deal? Im pretty sure you can live off of 200 grand without crying over the lost 50.

As for this change to the national anthem, I appose it. That's like McDonalds trying to compete with Nathans. It just shouldn't happen. When you have something that defines a country, you dont change it. its in history books for god sake. It may not be very established like other national anthems, but it is still pretty significant to American history.

Give obama a chance.

There are a few policies i don't agree with, but above all, i dont agree with immature assholes who feel the need to call him osama, or the new hitler, or obomber.

I am tired of arguing this subject. I have been debating about this since i posted that blog post.

He does have 4 years to prove himself, but I'm still not in agreement on Obama's policies. I shouldn't have said he was handed the election as much as I should have said the democratic party was. Republicans failed to please the mass in an 8 year term, so the democrats were exposed to a victory this election. Any democratic candidate would have one, whether it were by as much or not isn't of consequence. It's the fact that people voted on emotion as much as they did on the policies.

As for the country's foundation, I have to disagree with you Technogeek as well. I'm agnostic and for years i was atheist. What this means is that I've never really had the belief in God fully.

This Nation is a nation based around freedom. America was founded for the rights of others. While we may be hypocritical throughout history, we've made progress and it's our freedom that makes us so powerful. After all, if the country was founded around religious basis then we might as well throw out part of the 1st amendment.

Actually yes it is. It's not the fact that we can't live off of 200. It's the fact that this hard earned money, for the hours he works and days, is being given to other people on the basis of what? It's fair? Is it fair that there are people who don't work as hard getting the money? People who dropped out of high school, college, or didn't think well of their future and are where they're at now. I know there are many who work hard, but there are others who really don't and won't. It's not fair to take the money of those who have made success and give it to others.

My family wasn't always making 250,000. They worked up from lower payment to what they have now so for you to go and say that it doesn't really matter is actually pretty intense. It does matter. That money can be put into other things for my family. Fair? I don't think so.

I accept that he is the president but I am not happy with it. That's all.

nice to know im being agreed with on one of my points.

Aj, vz, ba, and bdx., you have stated give Obama a chance......pfft i'll give him a chance alright and when he slips up be damn sure i'll be there.....

[/QUOTE]And my problem with the anthem is just that... Reliance on God... What happened to seperation of church and State? That kind of bought it with Bush in power and I think Obama realises this. It's time to set things right. If you don't like it... Tough shit. You're a big boy now, you can just learn to live with it. So in the future, try not to throw tantrums bout it, it won't solve anything, m'kay?[/QUOTE]


You know.... i knew it was only a matter of time until vz posted something like this that would really piss me off. Vz i got nothing against you personally.....but tough shit.... HAHA thats not gonna stop me.. so what do i have to say to you?.......how about....tough shit?

this argument is leaving me with an unwanted (but not at all unexptected) amout of surpless bile.

I am increadibly sickened with some of you. Not by the fact that barely any of you are christian because i knew i couldn't change that... but you decide to let things that shouldn't be tampered with be changed.

And the separation of church and state....Im gonna tell you right now that argument royally pisses me off. "WAAA SEPAWATION OF CHUWCH AND STAATE WAAAA!!" it makes all of us christians look like the bad guys........

ya know what screw it.. I know where my afterlife is so i don't have to worry.

And nobody bother trying to counter me with the "compassion" card. because believe me i tried that.

Now trust me Obama makes the slightest "Bill Clinton Error" and im starting some sort a riot. I don't give a damn what i'll be getting myself into.

The apacolypse is approching and do i feel sorry for the lot of you.

So what have i learned today?

I blame the american people for letting so many things change. (not the fact that a black man is allowed to run for president. Im not raceist)

I blame myself for getting my hopes on this election up.

I blame the world for eveything.

I blame myself for thinking i could make a decent argument here.

I blame myself again for posting when i cleary said i wasn't going too.

STW!

sincerely.....
Technogeek

:angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

And do what exactly? Shit yourself at how fast the security guards have apprehended you? Who do you think you are?

I love how you ASSume that I am not Christian, or Christian-like based on my beliefs. BDX and I were raised by our Christian mother and great-grandmother, and they raised us to treat those around us with respect, and treat them the way we wanted to be treated. With the amount of time that we have spent in church on Sundays, and having to read the Bible, specifically, Psalms 100, and 134 every night before bed and praying every night, and after waking up, and even our mentality and acceptance of others, I really don't see how you can say that we aren't Christian.

Given your irate attitude, and reasoning, I really don't see how you can claim to be Christian yourself. You seem like the kind of person Jesus warned others about during the Sermon On The Mount. Didn't Jesus forgive those who crucified him? Isn't compassion apart of his teachings? Didn't god say that you should forgive those who wrong you? Last time I checked, that was in the Bible, and in the Lord's Prayer. Doesn't Jesus say, "Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy." Quite frankly, I don't see how you can claim to be a Christian without that "compassion card" since it was pretty much one of Jesus's teachings. According to Matthew, Chapter 25, verse 35,

Compassion is in the bible, and seems to be the basis for determining a true Christian.

So if you have "tried it" and are done with it, or are going to go around and start a riot then you really aren't a true Christian, or a child of God but someone who falsely claims to be one.

Just because we don't condemn people for being different, show compassion, and respect peoples right to decide for themselves, doesn't mean that we aren't Christian.. or good people for that matter.. because technically, under the religion, and belief itself, we are Christian, and moreso then you'll ever be. I'd like to think that because we live our lives as good people, and try to help others and not hurt them, or condemn them for being different that we are doing the very thing that God would want us all to do.

It is people that think the way you do who have the same warped belief about what Christianity really is, that are using the Bible for their own twisted agenda, and preaching that hateful message in church that are the very reason BDX and I don't follow religion, or even identify ourselves as Christian. If being Christian means that we have to conduct ourselves in the same way as you have in this topic, then I guess you are right.. we aren't Christian.. but I wouldn't consider that to be a bad thing either. We aren't making Christians look bad, you're doing a fantastic job of that yourself.

If there is no separation of church and state, then there would be no freedom. The U.S. would be just as restrictive as those third-world countries restricting people's rights. There would be no Democracy. Why do you consider freedom to be a bad thing? Why are you trying to control everyone else?

Moving on..

The only person who is sickening in this topic is the one who can't debate his point without resorting to personal attacks. Follow CH's and everyone else's example. Debate respectfully.

Just because we don't have the same beliefs, doesn't mean that we aren't entitled to them. If you are against another member's point, fine, debate it, if you have enough facts, then you shouldn't have to bring religion into a discussion that has no place for it.. as religion doesn't really say anything about your point other than the fact that you probably don't have one.

If you can't state your opinion in a mature manner without being belligerent, then you sure as hell needn't be in this area.

So if this subject matter is too much for you to talk about without being a troll, then say the word, and I will gladly put you in the group where you no longer have access to these areas.

I hate to say this, but you are showing the same level of irate reasoning as those who are against this country. If Obama fucks up enough in office, then he will be impeached.

Nixon fucked up royally in office, and what happened? He was impeached. No one said anything about us supporting him for changing things that shouldn't be changed. We are simply saying give him a chance.. well its not like you have a choice to anyway.

And I have news for you, this country wouldn't be what it is today if it weren't for change. You would not be here, and neither would I. This country has changed a lot since the settlers arrived. Some of it bad, some of it good. Change is not necessarily a bad thing. Tell me, what are some of these changes that you have a problem with? Do you know who else is angered by change and freedom of choice? Terrorists.

If the whole Watergate thing never happened, Nixon wouldn't have been impeached. Oh, and techno, for saying that if Obama makes a Clinton mistake? Bill Clinton's only mistake was messing around with Monica Lewinski or however you spell her name. He should have known that there would be repercussions, but apparently he didn't care that much. Anyway, I doubt that Obama would make the same mistakes that past presidents did. ESPECIALLY Nixon, Bush Sr., and Bush Jr. Obama is, for the moment, the lesser of two evils. Not calling Barack Obama bad, but I'm saying that we will lose money regardless. In this case, we'll get more money than we'll lose. If McCain were to have been elected, we would be screwed at this very moment. The inauguration would be going on at this moment if McCain and Palin got into office.
Okay, my rant is done.

You have to wait some months before the inauguration so no to that..
And George Bush Senior. won the Gulf War. What's wrong with him? Nixon was never actually impeached either. He resigned. That's not being impeached, as much as he should have been. As far as I know, no president has ever actually been impeached.

God, not this whole thing about religion again.

Alright lets get this going.

First off. There SHOULD be a separation of church and state. Why? Because people were getting persecuted for their religious beliefs. A country should not be run by the leaders religion.

Now, as for this whole thing with Christianity and what not, I've got to say. You're making it seem like Christians are the higher hope. The pinnacle of religion. Well may i introduce you to...

Chris Forcand

And not just this guy. I'm tired of these religions parading around and acting like their the way to live. Live in fear. You have catholic priest raping boys, you have Muslims killing themselves because this is what their god wanted. Do you REALLY think that is what they want? How the hell do you interpret the bible into what YOU think it means? Religion is a sham. The word of god has been so twisted around that not even the priests know what to teach. Literally, everything i ask, i get told "The bible already predicted it." Complete and utter bullshit.

Now don't get me wrong, I believe in god, and Jesus, and i believe in hell. But you know what, I have done right in my life way more than any christian has. Other then having pre-marital sex, I am pretty much sin free. No drugs, No parental disrespect, I give if i can, and i dont expect anything back. I don't fantasize about pedophilia or anything disgusting of the sort. If i am going to hell because i had sex, then whats the point?

Techno, you act like you're a martyr. Doing things for a greater cause. Trying to change us. Why? For what purpose? Because we dont follow what you say we are sinners? Or idiots?

By the way.

Violence is a sin. Riots lead to violence. For you to say something like that and parade around like you're some sort of higher being makes you the biggest hypocrite of them all. As far as I am concerned, there is nothing you can even say to combat this. I know this much, religion is usually all about peace and understanding. Especially Christian and Catholicism.

Book of Proverbs, chapter 3...

Proverbs chapter 3 (TEV)

27 Whenever you possibly can, do good to those who need it.

28 Never tell your neighbors to wait until tomorrow if you can help them now.

29 Don't plan anything that will hurt your neighbors; they live beside you, trusting you.

30 Don't argue with others for no reason when they have never done you any harm.

31 Don't be jealous of violent people or decide to act as they do.

Edit: Oh wait Christians make 'holy wars'

Oh no... Hurt your feelings did I? Like I said, grow up. You didn't seem to mind so much when your spouting that religious crap all over everywhere... I'll say this, Religion is fine, I haven't a problem with it so much as the bible pushers, the ones who think they're doing God's work by preaching to everyone, trying to save them. These are the same people who when a disagreement arises they rush to that book, scour the pages and try and find something in it to use against everyone else. But you know what? it's just a book. And the words in that book can be twisted to say whatever message you want them to say. Don't believe me?

Seriously, I'm sure in the bible it decrys killing, yes? Well then, violence in vidoegames is killing, or atleast inciting others to kill (so some people would have you believe.) So then doesn't that mean the bible is now against videogames... Sorry there Techno, but your halo games aren't kosher with the man upstairs. Guess you better abandon them now before you get sentenced to the pit for sinning.

My point in that is that don't bring religion to a serious discussion, it doesn't prove anything because religion can be twisted far to easily... (As well here's a good quote for you to remember... "To have faith you must abandon logic, to have logic you must question faith." The two are incompatible. So don't try and inject one into a discussion about the other. This here is about logic, not faith.)

Now, you can moan all you want, but it doesn't matter, you hissy-fit ain't gonna change anything. So might as well take the time and get used to it now.

And the seperation of church and state has been that way for a long time, because state affairs and church affairs are different. In a free country, not everyone should be forced to believe something. But you know what? Many of the religious people I hear from, who preach it, tend to pretend they're the victims of opression. "Look at us christians, victims of oppression for 2000 years." Bull crap, stop and look, how many times do you see christians preaching to others telling them how to live their lives. Calling you, showing up at your door, making nuisances of themselves everyday. Now maybe I'm wrong bout this, but is that not harassment? And against what God wants? God wants love right? And how is harassing others love?

And speaking of which, for all your yammering about not being racist, you seem to be making alot of noise bout it. And also getting into a riot over it? how is that God's will? Better make sure you like your bed warm, because if you procede with that course of action, the man upstairs will have you roasting on an open pit fire like a chicken wing.

Everyone keeps saying it'll affect me in Australia, but oh well.

Either way, I don't mind whose in office in America, because I frankly hope he fixes society in America and such.

Then again I'm pessimistic and little hope for mankind so disregard what I think with a side of cheese.

You're right, Nixon resigned before he was impeached, but it doesn't change the fact that we have the power to impeach, should a president fail, or abuse his power while in office.

DM, I'm not sure how it affects Austrailia.. unless it has something to do with trade etc.. but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt..

Only if he abuses his power or does something worth impeaching. I think with a 30% approval rating people would have impeached Bush if they could have..

Ba...Bdx.....You should really tell me these things.....I call myslef a christian because i have a personal releation ship with the savior. Im happy to know you know the bible and everything but you believe in getting to heaven by living a good life yes? Why do i feel like i have to change everyone? Im an evangelist...Its what I do. I don't want to see anyone burning if ya get my drift. And as far as the way i've been arguing..Thats what happens when people piss off an 18 year old male with aspergers syndrome and lvl 1 trourretts(such as myself)

and this is why i didn't want to get in this argument because just like it already happened. Within 1 day i got the entire hc community to hate me again. except for vz im pretty sure he hates me anyway.

Screw it. I said my thoughs I planted the seed I did my job. One more restatement of my opinion and im walking away.

I don't believe Obama belongs in office. Not because he's african american but because of what he stands for. The only good thing that has come from his presidancy so far is the growing confidence he has givin african american citizens. he gets points for that.

so there you have it. civilized discussion yes?

for future referances when refering to myself reming me to use the term Born-Again christian and yes there a differance between a christian and a born-again christian

I don't hate you. Hate is too strong of an emotion to just take back like nothing was said. I don't hate anyone.

As for you being an evangelist, you are not pure enough. Evangelists follow the word of god COMPLETELY when they promote their religion. You didn't respond to the obama riot, and in this situation, a simple 'you're right, O'm sorry' is just not enough to explain. You have rage in your heart to want to commit an act of violence, and you cant go bout spreading the word when you aren't pure yourself.

No, don't restate your opinion. You talk about this stuff, but you cant handle debate. It like all Christians.

Yes, it is true. Me and B.A were raised with devout christian influence. All that stuff about how this is because of God and that is because of God, we find questionable. If the bible was true, why are their many versions of it?

You didn't plant any seeds here, because you have not provided enough argument on the topic to let it fertilize in the minds of people. You basically just tossed some seeds at the floor and walked away.

With that being said, I don't hate you techno. I don't even dislike you. Some of the stuff you say are typical christian hypocrisy with the typical christian response to everything; avoiding the subject of their own trasngressions or replying with 'you guys cant be saved'.

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Cant we all see things eye to eye? =(

ummm when did i say i wanted violence. Sure i said i would start a riot but i didn't say i want to kill anyone.

and what do you mean soo many different versions of the bible. While there are some bibles that are made to target a certain audience. They all say the same thing. The most common difference in bibles are King James and NIV

King james uses "ye olde english" lol kidding i mean the kj version uses thys, yees thow's etc. While the NIV's use modern day english which is easier to understand

Riots begets violence and vandalism. You are starting a violent cause. PROTESTS are peaceful. You cant take it back now.

ugh ur taking my words outta context. ok so i meant protest.

please pardon my typing because at the time i was blinded by anger.

i must see through eyes unclouded by hate. (bonus points if you can tell where i'm quoting from)

but when i said riot i didn't say i was going to kill , mame, butrailly injure, hurt, spit in face, anyone i meant start something against obama, in your terms, protest.

No, we're not taking the words out of context... We're using them as they are normally used. It just seems that in this case you don't actually know what the words mean.

Case in point:

Riot-
1. a noisy, violent public disorder caused by a group or crowd of persons, as by a crowd protesting against another group, a government policy, etc., in the streets.
2. Law. a disturbance of the public peace by three or more persons acting together in a disrupting and tumultuous manner in carrying out their private purposes.
3. violent or wild disorder or confusion.

Source

And please, don't try and wheedle your way out of it now, cause remember what you do in anger doesn't get cleared away just because your not angry anymore. And using anger is never an excuse for what you did/said.


And you should know I don't hate you, I just don't like how you're carrying your argument.

No see, taking words out of context would me calling you a racist. I took what you said and applied it.

And, like i have said before, writing cant be easily excused, due to the fact that you can think before you write, and even so delete what you say. You cant be coerced into an opinion dude. Also, typing is even harder to excuse. Especially with the handy backspace key.

As for you not doing it yourself, its still no excuse do to the fact that you started it. If Obama gets hurt because of a riot, you are still going to get charged, even if you didn't do it.

Point is, politicians make mistakes as well. They are human. If McCain made a mistake, would you drive into him? No. Like McCain said, he is still your president. Show him some respect.

I respect him as the president of the united states. damn it i hate aspergers syndrome. yea ur lucky cuz ya have no idea what its like living with this.
not that anyone is gonna play the sympathy card but don't try saying you do because quite frankly you don't. "you never understand a guy until you get in his shoes and walk in them, crawl inside his skin and move around in it"

and im no hypocrite but i meant protese ok. like i said you wouldn't understand so quite frankly i don't know why im trying.

I really don't see the relevance in BDX and I telling you our religious background has to this topic. Whether we are devout or not, you still shouldn't assume to know things about people.

I am rather curious as to why you blame yourself. If you are of legal voting age, then you vote, and that's it. There really isn't much else you can do after that.

You still have to accept Jesus's teaching, in order to be considered as a true Christian. You can't do that if you have no compassion, and are constantly judging others, especially if it is not your place to do so. Last I read, both God and Jesus had a problem with that. Didn't he say, "Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone."

I'm sorry that you have to deal with AS, and Tourettes. I am not going to sit here and say that I know what you are going through. That said, everybody has their own stuff. BDX and I have very bad tempers, I used to have ADD as a child, and there is a very strong possibility, that I have it again as an adult. However, I still think before I post. There is no excuse in you not doing the same either.

The next time you are angry and want to post, try to control yourself, open up notepad, and post what you want to say in there and save it. Wait a few hours, and then read it, and if you are absolutely sure that you want to post it, then do so.

We don't hate you, we just disagreed with your opinion, and disliked how you stated it. Well, I can't speak for everyone else, but those are my sentiments nonetheless.

Fair enough, but it wasn't only Blacks he gave hope to, it was also the Americans who voted for him as well.

That is exactly the reason BDX and I don't judge anyone, and instead leave people their own devices. All we can do is control our actions, and no one elses, so there is no point to judging others, and really, it isn't our place to do so. That was the point we've been making all along.

I forgot to add that like with A.J. This is the first time, I am hearing about a change in the national anthem. Do you have any links to sources that say that Obama will change the national anthem? Because I did not know that he was going to change it, and I have been watching this election like a hawk.

The only thing I've seen was where he didn't put his hand over his heart during the national anthem. I have also read that he doesnt want to wear the pin because many people throughout the world consider the flag to be a symbol of oppression.

Smells like bullshit to me..

Bottomline is that if Obama was to try to change something as important as the National Anthem, then the people would not have voted for him. Furthermore, as much as they harped on the Jeremiah Wright issue, and on the fact that Obama hasn't as much experience as others, that they would have jumped at the chance to put this out there, and as much as the media has been on this election, this information would have spread like wildfire.

This only reaffirms my point about it being bullshit.

Yes i believe i've used that verse in the past. I do accept the teachings of jesus and i do have compassion. I used my compassion and i gave mercy i don't however believe in using it continuously. Don't get me wrong i know forgive 490 times and then 490 times more but i believe that making mistakes over and over again about maby the third time no more compassion

You may not believe in using compassion continuously, but Jesus does, and to be considered a true Christian, you have to accept all of his teachings. Jesus said that you should for give 70 x 7 times. I don't think that he meant it mathematically, as I have always understood that you have an unlimited number of times to be forgiven. But I digress.

Do you have the links about the National Anthem?

Me? Short tempered? Bullocks. Maybe in the past but do you really think i can be short tempered when i was told to bite my tongue on certain things?

You know, no offense, but you bring up your disabilities like its a reason why you act like this. Yes i feel sorry for you, i really do, but you don't have to keep reminding us. I'm still going to argue with you no matter what.

As far as this whole thing goes on religion, i haven't even began to scale the mountain of controversies. Really, no offense, but im am not convinced that you are devout as you say you are. Granted, your disabilities make it hard, but even without them i have my doubts.